After what I think has been a very rocky first year of marriage, my husband finally got through to me and I've discovered what he figured out awhile ago... I'm quite bossy.
Now, he has his own demons and I know he's been working very hard on them, so I know it's in both of our best interests for me to fix my problems too.
Enter "The Surrendered Wife". I googled "how to be less bossy" and "how to be less controlling" and this book came up. I read it in two days and I love it. I'm just starting out trying the methods and was curious if anyone else had read it or would be open to reading it and discussing it here.
The biggest revelation for me has been that almost everything I'm saying that I think is "helpful" is really just communicating to him I don't trust his abilities. Additionally, if I really want to have a traditional marriage (and not be constantly stressed out) I need to give up doing the household finances - this hasn't been broached yet because I also know he doesn't really want to do them, so I'm waiting for a good moment to explain that I can't do it anymore and I need his help.
Anyway, thanks for listening to this and I would welcome any productive thoughts!
In all honesty managing the household finances is a feminine thing to do (the only reason why kikes are good at it because they're low T faggots)
a woman should manage the household if she's good at it
as for the "less bossy and controlling" you know the phrase "one body two heads"? yeah, this is exactly the problem you're facing one and only ONE person with the appropriate leadership skills should be in charge
men (and i mean actual men, and not those TV watching, beer gulping faggots) don't like to be commanded by their inferiors
a man is the protector and leader, if he can't lead then he fails in his role as a man
though i think you need to fill us with a little more information before we can draw a conclusion to the anxiety that plagues your household
are you having disagreements on spending? or simply disagreements on leadership?
So I can't agree that household finances are a "feminine thing to do". They're based around math, which is typically stronger in men, and the person who controls the finances has the ultimate veto power on any purchases since they're more familiar with if the family can afford something. If the woman has the ultimate veto power, she's now in a position of power above her husband. And this being the "Traditional Wifes" subverse, I was looking for feedback from that perspective.
There's a lot more to it but really i'm just looking for other women to talk to, preferably who've read the book since it's explained much better there than I can explain.
Not a woman, but just to point out that historically many cultures have had women as the primary bookkeepers. This isn't to say that women made all the major purchasing decisions, more that her husband trusted her with day to day spending and (ideally) women worked hard to stretch it as far as possible.
Certainly in Japan/China/Korea I've read that haggling and bargainhunting was considered unmanly, not sure if that also applied to europeans in the same period.
Anyhow, if you're sorting things out for the better with you and your husband then good for you.
I don't think the act of being bossy is a problem. It's great that he has a partner willing to help him become better, think differently or push him toward a goal. Its a partnership afterall. Maybe its just how you present it. I think you are correct in thinking you're helping him. You're also correct in thinking you're questioning his abilities because you are. However, if im doing something wrong i want to know.
Is he bettering himself in the marriage department or are you putting this on yourself? He should be working on being the best leader he can.
Good luck! Check out Dave Ramsey if you need help with the finances.
Edit- i forgot to mention you sound like a great catch for working on your marriage and taking those vows seriously. I hope he recognizes that.
Being bossy IS a problem. OP's husband recognizes it, and finally at long last she recognized it also. If marriage is going to work, it needs to be a union of two complementary people, and being bossy creates friction. This applies to both partners, so I'm not defending a double standard.
The attitude between the two needs to be one of respect and love. When one is being bossy, it creates a power differential and resentment in the other. This is unsustainable, whether it's well intended or not. Bossiness for the other's "betterment" can also be perceived as nagging or haranguing, and is never well received by the other. No one likes to be TOLD what to do, and nagging is ineffective.
OP is taking a step in the right direction by recognizing a fatal flaw in their relationship that could in time destroy it.
Edit: Left out "not" in sentence "I'm not defending a double standard"
Good points. I clearly don't know enough about the situation or history to say either way. I agree on the presentation though, is it nagging or is it constructive. Did her previous approaches fall on deaf ears or has she always behaved like this. Its nice to see progress is being made without giving up on the relationship, which seems to be the norm nowadays.
[ - ] sharkbait [op] 1 point 3.6 yearsOct 13, 2021 09:08:36 ago (+1/-0)
Thank you! Yes, this is what I'm going for. What this book is teaching me is that my husband is a grown-ass man and doesn't need another mother. I mean I thought I was being helpful, but the people on here saying that nagging can be a good thing are frankly misguided. I've realized there's no reason to tell him anything really. If he wants to leave his clothes on the floor now, I let him. BUT, I don't do any laundry that isn't in the hamper, so if he wants his clothes washed, he'll have to pick them up eventually. He also knows that I don't like clothes on the floor, so the better I treat him the more he wants to make me happy and the more likely he'll be to not put them there in the first place.
Again, the book has taught me that a happy man really WANTS his wife to be happy, and the occasional request every now and then will be met with joy instead if irritation. Also, it's better to have harmony than a "properly" loaded dishwasher. :)
[ - ] HughBriss 1 point 3.6 yearsOct 12, 2021 17:59:55 ago (+1/-0)
OP, good for you for recognizing your "bossiness". This is also called nagging, and no one likes to live with that. Learn from this, tone it down, and try to be a better, more loving, and more respectful partner. Work with your husband about doing the finances. I have no idea of what your circumstances are, i.e., whether you work, what your jobs are, how much each of you contribute to to the household both monetarily and with labor, whether you're home owners, whether you have children, etc. These are all important factors, but for the sake of the longevity of your marriage, discuss this together and work something out. Money is a common reason why marriages break up.
Money isn't actually a problem for us at all. We both work and earn well. The problem comes from me having all the veto power when it comes to spending. The book taught me that my controlling nature originates from fear that if I'm not in charge, things won't be done correctly (which is often how I feel). The result is a husband that can't spoil me with gifts (the way most wives would like - not in a greedy way though) or make major money-related decisions because I know better about what can/can't be spent. I also don't think he's as motivated to make more money (he has his own business and the money that comes in is directly related to effort put in) because he doesn't really see the positive impact he has financially with me paying all the bills and choosing what to save/spend.
I want to let go of this responsibility because I think it would be better for both of us. Even if he screws things up, I know we aren't going to lose our house or go bankrupt - he's a very hard worker, even if he's not as organized as I am. It would also force me to trust in him more. And for him I think he'd see the impact of his work better and be able to give me the money I need to buy groceries, gas, clothes, etc. without issue. I think he'd be more excited to get out and work (which he really does love to do) and take care of his wife the way every man wants to, when they're in a happy marriage.
That makes perfect sense. You have very good self awareness. Marriage doesn't automatically come easy and requires effort to make it work. It sounds like you have everything you need. I wish you both long life and happiness.
As an oldfag there are two things I can think of that might help your situation.
First is that a man needs to be respected. Not for his benefit, but for yours. If you don't respect him, you'll find yourself treating him like shit and eventually trying to leave. Nearly every time I've seen a woman cheat she showed her man she didn't respect him before she did. Much of the shit testing younger women do is to make the man earn her respect. If your husband is smart hearing you say "I'm losing respect for you" should make him jump up and immediately work to solve whatever the problem is. "I don't trust his abilities" sounds to me like "I dont respect him."
Second is that people seem to have lost sight of the fact that all the things we people tend to paint as negative traits are often highly effective tools. Hatred is a tool. Lust is a tool. Nagging is a tool. Nagging is how women get men's work done. If you find yourself using one of these "negative" things, figure out why. If you're always arguing there has to be a reason. If you're nagging or being bossy there is probably a reason. If that reason is that you're a better leader/organizer/supervisor and he's a better worker then there is nothing wrong with falling into those roles when appropriate.
[ - ] sharkbait [op] 1 point 3.6 yearsOct 13, 2021 09:11:09 ago (+1/-0)
While I think Seventh_Jim was maybe a bit harsh, I also think he's right. There's no place in a marriage for nagging. Nagging has never made a man want to listen to his wife.
Any man can be a leader with his wife if she steps out of the way and allows him to.
On an unrelated note, are there any actual women in this "Traditional Wives" subverse? I was hoping for some female camaraderie...
I think you both misunderstood. You don't want to be nagging, if you find yourself nagging, or doing something else we'd consider negative, you want to look for the root cause. If you're nagging him about the garbage, then why isn't he taking care of the garbage? You need to find a system that works for him. Maybe he needs a todo list or a set time he does these things. Finding that system should remove the need for nagging.
Think of nagging, hate and anger like the low fuel light on your car. It's nature's way of waking you up to the fact that something has moved from a task into the danger zone and now it's a problem. We are all angry about they treatment of Kyle Rittenhouse because the courts are not doing what they're supposed to be doing. Sitting around being angry or yelling at our friends isn't going to help, replacing the people running the courts will. Anger spurs us to action on things that need to be done, but have been neglected. Nagging is a woman's natural way to spur men to do tasks they've neglected.
When you want something,try to keep it short and sweet. Over explaining can be a common problem for both genders and can easily become nagging. Practice asking for things with the fewest words possible. It's not only easier on the listener,it's easier on you if you have to repeat yourself.
If you're talking to someone who's busy,get their attention enough to know they noticed you then give them a moment to wrap up what they're doing before talking so they can give you their full attention. You never know how much of their attention is focused on what they're doing,so even simple questions might require too much.
If you think of something that needs to be done,write it down so you don't forget. A list of things to do also helps those around you keep track of things that need doing.
Keeping a good house means keeping track of what needs to be done. You should be able to handle most things on your own,but don't be afraid to ask for help on the harder stuff.
Give your husband a hug and a kiss every so often to remind him you love him.
Your goal as a homemaker is to create an island of sanity in a world gone mad. Where things make sense and there's joy and happiness. This is a long job that requires everyday effort. Pace yourself.
[ + ] fightknightHERO
[ - ] fightknightHERO 4 points 3.6 yearsOct 12, 2021 15:16:42 ago (+4/-0)
a woman should manage the household
if she's good at it
as for the "less bossy and controlling"
you know the phrase "one body two heads"? yeah, this is exactly the problem you're facing
one and only ONE person with the appropriate leadership skills should be in charge
men (and i mean actual men, and not those TV watching, beer gulping faggots) don't like to be commanded by their inferiors
a man is the protector and leader, if he can't lead then he fails in his role as a man
though i think you need to fill us with a little more information before we can draw a conclusion to the anxiety that plagues your household
are you having disagreements on spending? or simply disagreements on leadership?
[ + ] sharkbait
[ - ] sharkbait [op] 0 points 3.6 yearsOct 13, 2021 08:54:37 ago (+0/-0)
There's a lot more to it but really i'm just looking for other women to talk to, preferably who've read the book since it's explained much better there than I can explain.
[ + ] Broc_Liath
[ - ] Broc_Liath 0 points 3.4 yearsDec 8, 2021 17:19:31 ago (+0/-0)
Certainly in Japan/China/Korea I've read that haggling and bargainhunting was considered unmanly, not sure if that also applied to europeans in the same period.
Anyhow, if you're sorting things out for the better with you and your husband then good for you.
[ + ] HelpAcct123
[ - ] HelpAcct123 0 points 3.6 yearsOct 12, 2021 16:40:21 ago (+0/-0)
I think you are correct in thinking you're helping him. You're also correct in thinking you're questioning his abilities because you are. However, if im doing something wrong i want to know.
Is he bettering himself in the marriage department or are you putting this on yourself? He should be working on being the best leader he can.
Good luck! Check out Dave Ramsey if you need help with the finances.
Edit- i forgot to mention you sound like a great catch for working on your marriage and taking those vows seriously. I hope he recognizes that.
[ + ] HughBriss
[ - ] HughBriss 2 points 3.6 yearsOct 12, 2021 17:55:43 ago (+2/-0)*
The attitude between the two needs to be one of respect and love. When one is being bossy, it creates a power differential and resentment in the other. This is unsustainable, whether it's well intended or not. Bossiness for the other's "betterment" can also be perceived as nagging or haranguing, and is never well received by the other. No one likes to be TOLD what to do, and nagging is ineffective.
OP is taking a step in the right direction by recognizing a fatal flaw in their relationship that could in time destroy it.
Edit: Left out "not" in sentence "I'm not defending a double standard"
[ + ] HelpAcct123
[ - ] HelpAcct123 1 point 3.6 yearsOct 12, 2021 19:12:57 ago (+1/-0)
I agree on the presentation though, is it nagging or is it constructive. Did her previous approaches fall on deaf ears or has she always behaved like this. Its nice to see progress is being made without giving up on the relationship, which seems to be the norm nowadays.
[ + ] sharkbait
[ - ] sharkbait [op] 1 point 3.6 yearsOct 13, 2021 09:08:36 ago (+1/-0)
Again, the book has taught me that a happy man really WANTS his wife to be happy, and the occasional request every now and then will be met with joy instead if irritation. Also, it's better to have harmony than a "properly" loaded dishwasher. :)
[ + ] HughBriss
[ - ] HughBriss 1 point 3.6 yearsOct 12, 2021 17:59:55 ago (+1/-0)
[ + ] sharkbait
[ - ] sharkbait [op] 0 points 3.6 yearsOct 13, 2021 09:04:04 ago (+0/-0)
I want to let go of this responsibility because I think it would be better for both of us. Even if he screws things up, I know we aren't going to lose our house or go bankrupt - he's a very hard worker, even if he's not as organized as I am. It would also force me to trust in him more. And for him I think he'd see the impact of his work better and be able to give me the money I need to buy groceries, gas, clothes, etc. without issue. I think he'd be more excited to get out and work (which he really does love to do) and take care of his wife the way every man wants to, when they're in a happy marriage.
Does that make sense?
[ + ] HughBriss
[ - ] HughBriss 0 points 3.6 yearsOct 13, 2021 09:11:33 ago (+0/-0)
[ + ] ForgottenMemes
[ - ] ForgottenMemes -1 points 3.6 yearsOct 12, 2021 20:01:54 ago (+0/-1)
First is that a man needs to be respected. Not for his benefit, but for yours. If you don't respect him, you'll find yourself treating him like shit and eventually trying to leave. Nearly every time I've seen a woman cheat she showed her man she didn't respect him before she did. Much of the shit testing younger women do is to make the man earn her respect. If your husband is smart hearing you say "I'm losing respect for you" should make him jump up and immediately work to solve whatever the problem is. "I don't trust his abilities" sounds to me like "I dont respect him."
Second is that people seem to have lost sight of the fact that all the things we people tend to paint as negative traits are often highly effective tools. Hatred is a tool. Lust is a tool. Nagging is a tool. Nagging is how women get men's work done. If you find yourself using one of these "negative" things, figure out why. If you're always arguing there has to be a reason. If you're nagging or being bossy there is probably a reason. If that reason is that you're a better leader/organizer/supervisor and he's a better worker then there is nothing wrong with falling into those roles when appropriate.
[ + ] sharkbait
[ - ] sharkbait [op] 1 point 3.6 yearsOct 13, 2021 09:11:09 ago (+1/-0)
Any man can be a leader with his wife if she steps out of the way and allows him to.
On an unrelated note, are there any actual women in this "Traditional Wives" subverse? I was hoping for some female camaraderie...
[ + ] ForgottenMemes
[ - ] ForgottenMemes 0 points 3.6 yearsOct 13, 2021 10:55:11 ago (+0/-0)
Think of nagging, hate and anger like the low fuel light on your car. It's nature's way of waking you up to the fact that something has moved from a task into the danger zone and now it's a problem. We are all angry about they treatment of Kyle Rittenhouse because the courts are not doing what they're supposed to be doing. Sitting around being angry or yelling at our friends isn't going to help, replacing the people running the courts will. Anger spurs us to action on things that need to be done, but have been neglected. Nagging is a woman's natural way to spur men to do tasks they've neglected.
[ + ] account deleted by user
[ - ] account deleted by user -1 points 3.6 yearsOct 13, 2021 00:37:37 ago (+0/-1)
[ + ] Merlynn
[ - ] Merlynn 0 points 3.6 yearsOct 12, 2021 21:11:29 ago (+0/-0)
If you're talking to someone who's busy,get their attention enough to know they noticed you then give them a moment to wrap up what they're doing before talking so they can give you their full attention. You never know how much of their attention is focused on what they're doing,so even simple questions might require too much.
If you think of something that needs to be done,write it down so you don't forget. A list of things to do also helps those around you keep track of things that need doing.
Keeping a good house means keeping track of what needs to be done. You should be able to handle most things on your own,but don't be afraid to ask for help on the harder stuff.
Give your husband a hug and a kiss every so often to remind him you love him.
Your goal as a homemaker is to create an island of sanity in a world gone mad. Where things make sense and there's joy and happiness. This is a long job that requires everyday effort. Pace yourself.
[ + ] Teefinyomouf
[ - ] Teefinyomouf 0 points 3.6 yearsOct 12, 2021 23:04:53 ago (+0/-0)