I was setting up a HIKvsion serurity cam system this weekend.(DVR , 10 Ip cams and lots of cat cable) I could not get the cameras to stay online. No idea why, very vexing.
realized I was only having trouble with the cameras once they were removed from the base (shielding) and the cameras mother boards were exposed (had to reset the cams so I had to take them apart) Also suspect it was the cameras on the LOOONG run of cat6 and the cameras on the shorter runs were working.
Finally gave up in frustration.
Cam in Sunday morning to try again and the entire system was working perfectly.
I attrib this to the solar storm. (I have seen flakey computer systems int he Data center's before due to past solar storms as well)
A lot of cat6 isn't shielded very well, and long runs of cable, like 1850s telegraph wires, are especially susceptible to CME storms due to the huge attack surface. Probably enough of an electric force to over power the signal at the peak storm magnitudes.
I was surprised our infrastructure was quieter than normal. Not a single ticket or issue raised over the weekend and internal chatter stayed quiet as well.
Gave me enough time to summit a small mountain to watch the skies on a beautiful night.
A lot of the "space grade" protections have probably been migrated down to many of the consumer products, making some of the devices immune to small scale radiation events.
A CME is very much like a DC signal, and pretty easy to reject from high frequency transmissions.
I would expect the wifi signal to be way more stable than an equivalent cabled route, given the end equipment has the proper protection. A receiver with a good CMRR would probably not be bothered by the CME.
The biggest impacts for CME seem to be long runs of unshielded cable/wire/traces where the influence creates a stray DC voltage of some level that can damage electronics.
These are not large spikes, but something like putting 24V onto a 5V circuit. Not much will last for 2 days with the wrong applied voltage like that.
I would guess that an EMP is a much different animal compared to the CME radiation. EMPs are typically short burst high energy and a lot of frequencies.
CMEs are typically waves of particles that impact things, and particles are much easier to deal with through shielding. For instance, Alpha and Beta radiation particles can be stopped by clothes and paper, and the outer layer of skin. Alpha particles are dangerous when ingested because the soft tissues get damaged by the particle impacts, whereas dead skin layer is pretty immune.
I didn't suggest that they were the same. I'm suggesting that the over-hyperventilating about the dangers of CME's turned out to be pure horseshit. And most of what we know and the dangers of EMP's are hypothetical and unproven. Probably over-hyped as well, to sell fear.
I believe a very strong CME with the earth's weakening magnetic field can be dangerous for the power grid, but maybe not much else.
If stopping damage is as simple as wrapping a device in tin foil, then it doesn't look like it would be a big deal.
However, the danger is that a CME would impact the power lines, and as the DC current flows through everything designed for AC current, the systems could overload.
As an example, say that a DC current of 100amps per km in a strong CME. Some power grid lines are hundreds of km long, and those usually end up at important points, like substations or power plants. Imagine a substation getting 5,000 or 10,000 amps DC through a transformer, which looks like an internal short to DC, that is rated for 5000 amps AC, and the AC is still going through it. Bad things can happen.
The hype is most likely carry over from the Carrington event that took people by surprise, because electricity other than telegraphs wasn't really developed, and not many people could explain the causes of all the weirdness. Fast forward 150 years with the telephone game and now chicken little is squawking pretty hard to make everyone afraid.
Southern lattitudes such as FL and TX are less succeptible than higher lattitudes... and while the KP went high so we got a great show, these were not X class flares.
[ + ]anon
[ - ] anon 3711033 2 points 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 11:04:26 ago (+2/-0)
realized I was only having trouble with the cameras once they were removed from the base (shielding) and the cameras mother boards were exposed (had to reset the cams so I had to take them apart) Also suspect it was the cameras on the LOOONG run of cat6 and the cameras on the shorter runs were working.
Finally gave up in frustration.
Cam in Sunday morning to try again and the entire system was working perfectly.
I attrib this to the solar storm. (I have seen flakey computer systems int he Data center's before due to past solar storms as well)
[ + ] anon
[ - ] anon 3680501 0 points 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 19:43:05 ago (+0/-0)
[ + ] mannerbund
[ - ] mannerbund 1 point 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 10:12:02 ago (+1/-0)
Gave me enough time to summit a small mountain to watch the skies on a beautiful night.
[ + ] bobdole9
[ - ] bobdole9 1 point 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 08:47:37 ago (+1/-0)
[ + ] anon
[ - ] anon 3955864 [op] 1 point 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 12:20:19 ago (+1/-0)
[ + ] bobdole9
[ - ] bobdole9 1 point 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 12:53:52 ago (+1/-0)
[ + ]anon
[ - ] anon 3680501 1 point 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 08:43:51 ago (+1/-0)
[ + ] anon
[ - ] anon 3955864 [op] 0 points 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 12:06:02 ago (+0/-0)
[ + ] anon
[ - ] anon 3955864 [op] 0 points 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 12:08:59 ago (+0/-0)
[ + ] anon
[ - ] anon 3680501 1 point 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 19:53:28 ago (+1/-0)
I would expect the wifi signal to be way more stable than an equivalent cabled route, given the end equipment has the proper protection. A receiver with a good CMRR would probably not be bothered by the CME.
The biggest impacts for CME seem to be long runs of unshielded cable/wire/traces where the influence creates a stray DC voltage of some level that can damage electronics.
These are not large spikes, but something like putting 24V onto a 5V circuit. Not much will last for 2 days with the wrong applied voltage like that.
[ + ] FreeinTX
[ - ] FreeinTX 1 point 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 08:18:40 ago (+1/-0)
[ + ] anon
[ - ] anon 3955864 [op] 0 points 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 12:09:53 ago (+0/-0)
[ + ] anon
[ - ] anon 3680501 0 points 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 19:48:00 ago (+0/-0)
CMEs are typically waves of particles that impact things, and particles are much easier to deal with through shielding. For instance, Alpha and Beta radiation particles can be stopped by clothes and paper, and the outer layer of skin. Alpha particles are dangerous when ingested because the soft tissues get damaged by the particle impacts, whereas dead skin layer is pretty immune.
This is probably a good analogy of EMP vs CME.
[ + ] FreeinTX
[ - ] FreeinTX 0 points 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 19:56:16 ago (+0/-0)
[ + ] anon
[ - ] anon 3680501 0 points 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 22:00:08 ago (+0/-0)
If stopping damage is as simple as wrapping a device in tin foil, then it doesn't look like it would be a big deal.
However, the danger is that a CME would impact the power lines, and as the DC current flows through everything designed for AC current, the systems could overload.
As an example, say that a DC current of 100amps per km in a strong CME. Some power grid lines are hundreds of km long, and those usually end up at important points, like substations or power plants. Imagine a substation getting 5,000 or 10,000 amps DC through a transformer, which looks like an internal short to DC, that is rated for 5000 amps AC, and the AC is still going through it. Bad things can happen.
The hype is most likely carry over from the Carrington event that took people by surprise, because electricity other than telegraphs wasn't really developed, and not many people could explain the causes of all the weirdness. Fast forward 150 years with the telephone game and now chicken little is squawking pretty hard to make everyone afraid.
[ + ]anon
[ - ] anon 9219599 0 points 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 09:52:38 ago (+0/-0)*
and while the KP went high so we got a great show, these were not X class flares.[ + ] VitaminSieg
[ - ] VitaminSieg 2 points 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 12:20:26 ago (+2/-0)
[ + ] anon
[ - ] anon 9219599 0 points 1.1 yearsMay 13, 2024 13:09:04 ago (+0/-0)