Too many men kill themselves. I don't think stoicism and suffering in silence works, but I don't have an answer to such a complicated epidemic. I won't call it a problem because that downplays how bad it is.
Curing our culture (or replacing it) is the solution to the suicide epidemic and other self harm epidemics like drug addiction, obesity, etc. Theres no unity, no incentive for unity today. Stocism can be part of that cultural revival.
Agreed. However i take a slightly different view. Sad they are not able to just accept that which they cannot change for what it is, and endure through another day.
I'm reminded of that nigger mandela - 26 years solitary in an absolute shit hole apartheid State prison - with i believe 2 or 3 trump normies that took their own lives simply for finding out they were being charged for jan 6th.
Imo, Stoic Mindset, quietly enduring through adversity - and acceptance of things you cannot change. The sun always arises anew something something ...
Basically, how much one values their own life against things out of their control.
Stoicism is not about eliminating emotions but regulating them. Not being ruled by your emotions, having better control over your feelings and understanding you are only in control of how you respond to adversity. This boils down to stoics generally having a better understanding of themselves and those around them.
The reason that modern stoicism went mainstream coincided with the rise in the "MGTOW" community. Stoicism is really more subversive than it looks on the surface.
The biggest problem that I have with it is the absence of the importance of having and maintaining personal faith, ie. a personal connection and link with God. Men cannot be men without a grounded center in an understanding of how they're linked with God, whether through religion or not. While stoicism, on the surface, seems to be made to strengthen men, it's really doing the opposite if it doesn't reinforce faith-based principles of morality and mortality.
It would be pretty extraordinary for an Ancient Greek philosophy to make direct references to God. Lol.
The Stoic equivalent of God is "nature". Nature is the ethereal force which maintains order throughout the universe; the unseen power that creates and defines the physical realm. Stoics considered believing in a "higher power" of some sort to be a rational and logical belief, but didn't assign a human-like consciousness to it.
it's really doing the opposite if it doesn't reinforce faith-based principles of morality and mortality.
One of these vignettes is literally about morality and another is about mortality.
I find most religions promote avoidance of mortality. Certainly Christianity. It lies to people that theyre going to live forever if they believe in Yahweh/Jesus. This is a blandishment to join the religion . I won’t say that men can’t be grounded and also be religious. But it doesn’t help.
The problem with Stoicism is it doesnt have a congregation or organization like formal religions do ( it probably does somewhere, but nothing of note) and so the stoicist is left to interpret morality for himself, which can lead to problems.
Stoicism is a building block towards Catholicism in a pagan/atheist man. Its a net positive. It isnt for anything Saint Thomas Aquinas managed to unite Greek philosophy so well with Catholicism. Its proto-Catholicism for men.
Stocism is a building block of rational atheism in a Catholic man. I agree its a net positive. One step closer to abandoning fairy tales for reality . Its proto-atheism.
MGTOW is literally about avoiding relationships, that's the whole movement. It has nothing to do with religion, god, spiritualism, etc, just avoiding relationships.
MGTOW is about hating women, regardless of what it purports to be. Its about exagerating the flaws of group x (women) while ignoring the flaws of group y (men). Its an attractive narrative for certain types of personalities that are bad at personal responsibility and self reflection. Feminism works the same way.
Im not, actually. Nor have I ever been. Just because I don’t upvot videos of women being punched in the face doesn’t make me a feminist.
Some of you guys are really out of touch. You, in particular, lack self awareness of the flaws of your own sex. Contrary to your narrative that only men are capable of logic and accountability, you lack objectivity to examine your own behaviors, which are deeply problematic and largely to blame for the state of affairs today, i.e., male behaviors. You think women are driving the Ukraine war? But you will ignore the gender aspects of that kind of problem, of course.
Its more about having a mindset to control your response, rather than circumstances outside your control.
Its your christcuck conditioning that makes you think that the stoic philosophy is implying to get on your knees and suck cripple dick. Amor Fati means love your fate, it does not mean to be accepting being a slave.
Slave religion, going to slave I guess. You'd rather fight fellow inmates than the jailors.
As an aside, that's the absolute worst insult to call a metal head, particularly someone who primarily listens to black metal. It's our equivalent of being called nigger.
[ + ] TheNoticing
[ - ] TheNoticing 5 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 09:55:41 ago (+5/-0)
[ + ] PotatoWhisperer2
[ - ] PotatoWhisperer2 3 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 12:17:30 ago (+3/-0)
Brotherhood and community. Male only spaces within male controlled communities. White only communities that is.
[ + ] TheNoticing
[ - ] TheNoticing 1 point 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 18:31:39 ago (+1/-0)
[ + ] registereduser
[ - ] registereduser 2 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 13:46:03 ago (+2/-0)
Stoicism is not suffering, it is controlling ones emotion.
Don't be a faggot, and you won't want to kill your self.
[ + ] PostWallHelena
[ - ] PostWallHelena 2 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 12:50:26 ago (+2/-0)
[ + ] dassar
[ - ] dassar 1 point 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 13:46:26 ago (+1/-0)
Just as some run to a therapist, openly cry in front of strangers and constantly talk and share their issues with others.
[ + ] dassar
[ - ] dassar 0 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 14:21:20 ago (+0/-0)
Agreed. However i take a slightly different view.
Sad they are not able to just accept that which they cannot change for what it is, and endure through another day.
I'm reminded of that nigger mandela - 26 years solitary in an absolute shit hole apartheid State prison - with i believe 2 or 3 trump normies that took their own lives simply for finding out they were being charged for jan 6th.
Imo, Stoic Mindset, quietly enduring through adversity - and acceptance of things you cannot change. The sun always arises anew something something ...
Basically, how much one values their own life against things out of their control.
[ + ] UncleDoug
[ - ] UncleDoug [op] 0 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 16:43:20 ago (+0/-0)
[ + ] AlexanderMorose13
[ - ] AlexanderMorose13 4 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 09:17:37 ago (+5/-1)
The biggest problem that I have with it is the absence of the importance of having and maintaining personal faith, ie. a personal connection and link with God. Men cannot be men without a grounded center in an understanding of how they're linked with God, whether through religion or not. While stoicism, on the surface, seems to be made to strengthen men, it's really doing the opposite if it doesn't reinforce faith-based principles of morality and mortality.
[ + ] Jinglebanger
[ - ] Jinglebanger 4 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 10:38:49 ago (+4/-0)
The Stoic equivalent of God is "nature". Nature is the ethereal force which maintains order throughout the universe; the unseen power that creates and defines the physical realm. Stoics considered believing in a "higher power" of some sort to be a rational and logical belief, but didn't assign a human-like consciousness to it.
[ + ] PostWallHelena
[ - ] PostWallHelena 2 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 10:58:07 ago (+2/-0)
One of these vignettes is literally about morality and another is about mortality.
I find most religions promote avoidance of mortality. Certainly Christianity. It lies to people that theyre going to live forever if they believe in Yahweh/Jesus. This is a blandishment to join the religion . I won’t say that men can’t be grounded and also be religious. But it doesn’t help.
The problem with Stoicism is it doesnt have a congregation or organization like formal religions do ( it probably does somewhere, but nothing of note) and so the stoicist is left to interpret morality for himself, which can lead to problems.
[ + ] Razzoriel
[ - ] Razzoriel 2 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 12:34:40 ago (+2/-0)
[ + ] PostWallHelena
[ - ] PostWallHelena 0 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 12:47:04 ago (+2/-2)
[ + ] TheNoticing
[ - ] TheNoticing 1 point 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 09:57:00 ago (+2/-1)
[ + ] PostWallHelena
[ - ] PostWallHelena -1 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 10:27:12 ago (+2/-3)
[ + ] PotatoWhisperer2
[ - ] PotatoWhisperer2 3 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 12:15:54 ago (+3/-0)
[ + ] PostWallHelena
[ - ] PostWallHelena 0 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 12:44:00 ago (+2/-2)
Some of you guys are really out of touch. You, in particular, lack self awareness of the flaws of your own sex. Contrary to your narrative that only men are capable of logic and accountability, you lack objectivity to examine your own behaviors, which are deeply problematic and largely to blame for the state of affairs today, i.e., male behaviors. You think women are driving the Ukraine war? But you will ignore the gender aspects of that kind of problem, of course.
[ + ] PotatoWhisperer2
[ - ] PotatoWhisperer2 1 point 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 18:03:05 ago (+1/-0)
[ + ] RafalGanowicz
[ - ] RafalGanowicz 2 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 08:12:32 ago (+5/-3)
"I will accept my fate…" fuck right off.
[ + ] UncleDoug
[ - ] UncleDoug [op] 0 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 08:33:56 ago (+3/-3)
Its your christcuck conditioning that makes you think that the stoic philosophy is implying to get on your knees and suck cripple dick. Amor Fati means love your fate, it does not mean to be accepting being a slave.
Slave religion, going to slave I guess. You'd rather fight fellow inmates than the jailors.
[ + ] RafalGanowicz
[ - ] RafalGanowicz -1 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 08:50:22 ago (+3/-4)
If you had ever read a single one of his writings, you would know he was only concerned with the welfare of the State.
His writings are literally how to be a good goy, obedient, subservient tool of the government.
You are clearly a poseur.
[ + ] UncleDoug
[ - ] UncleDoug [op] 4 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 09:08:21 ago (+4/-0)
Amor Fati = No regrets.
Not like you though getting all BTFO, youre collecting regrets like pokemon.
[ + ] TheNoticing
[ - ] TheNoticing 3 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 09:58:37 ago (+3/-0)
As an aside, that's the absolute worst insult to call a metal head, particularly someone who primarily listens to black metal. It's our equivalent of being called nigger.
[ + ] RafalGanowicz
[ - ] RafalGanowicz -3 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 10:04:38 ago (+1/-4)
[ + ] PostWallHelena
[ - ] PostWallHelena 0 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 10:20:09 ago (+1/-1)
But theres nothing particularly masculine about these sentiments.
[ + ] UncleDoug
[ - ] UncleDoug [op] 0 points 2 monthsFeb 17, 2025 18:58:34 ago (+0/-0)
It's the mountain and the valley analogy. Men's worth is based on how high they climb the peak, a women by how far they fall from it.